Jack Blades: 'Look, dude, I'm a registered American, OK?'

Front left: Kelly Keagy, Eric Levy, Jack Blades, Joel Hoekstra and Brad Gillis of Night Ranger.

It was the summer of 1987 and the Lifestyles editor at The Daily Spectrum newspaper in St. George, Utah, was in the position of having to cut a deal.

I was fairly new to my gig as the sports editor there and had only a year under my belt in the daily newspaper business, and still quite unsure what my exact career path would be. The Lifestyles editor needed someone to cover a local Donny Osmond concert -- still a pretty important thing in that town in those days -- but she was scheduled to be out of town to attend a friend's wedding.

Suffice to say, she was getting no volunteers.

"I'll do it," I said, adding my one condition: That she also let me cover the Night Ranger concert that was coming up a few weeks later. The deal was beneficial to both parties. I loved Night Ranger ... and she didn't.

Since I was covering the show, I also got the opportunity to do an advance phone interview with Night Ranger bassist, vocalist and frontman Jack Blades. I remember nervously prepping for several days. The late-night interview, of course, turned out to be great fun -- I wish I still had a copy of it somewhere.

These days, I don't remember a whole lot about what was said during that initial interview, but one thing has always stuck with me. I found Jack amazingly down to earth, so I asked him how he balanced the demands of his crazy rock 'n' roll lifestyle with everyday life. He explained that all day he was Jack Blades the rock star, but there arrived a certain time each evening -- usually after a show -- where he reverted into just being Jack Blades the regular person. I always liked that analogy.

That chat with Jack was my very first rock-related interview. I parlayed that into a chance to shadow the band at the arena for a feature story on the typical day in the life of a rock band on the road -- getting glimpses into the band's pre- and post-show routines, and even a tour by guitarist Brad Gillis of the bus that would take the band up the road to its next scheduled date.
 
Some 25 years -- and hundreds of interviews/concerts later -- there's no question in my mind who got the better end of the Osmond-for-Night Ranger package story deal.

In my latest interview with Jack -- the rock star as it so happens since he called while the band was actually en route to the venue for a show in Atlanta a few hours later -- we discussed a variety of topics, ranging from his support of the U.S. troops -- the band's local appearance is a benefit concert for Operation Rebound on Sept. 11 -- to new music by Night Ranger and his Shaw/Blades side project with Styx guitarist (and former Damn Yankees cohort) Tommy Shaw.

But what really had Blades buzzing was his experience at the Republican National Convention, which ended the day before our interview on Aug. 31. Blades had already received a lot of blowback via social media for his decision to perform his new solo single, "Back in the Game," live at the convention and for supporting the GOP presidential ticket.

To say he remains perplexed by today's toxic political scene is an understatement.

"Look, dude, I'm a registered American, OK?" said Blades. "And what's with all the hating anyway?"

Well, read for yourselves ...

DOUG FOX: Well, I've got to say it really is a pleasure to speak with you again. Believe it or not, you were the first rock-related interview I ever did, and I was just figuring it out this morning and that was 25 years ago, so that's been a long time now.

JACK BLADES: Oh my ... it's nice to see we all still have a gig! (laughs)

DF: Yeah. It will be good to have you back in Utah again this year, I don't know if you remember but your very first show of 2012 was out in Wendover.

BLADES: You know, it was. And I can remember ... and I think it was like our second show or something like that was with Journey at (pause) ...

DF: Rio Tinto Stadium last year?

BLADES: Yeah, yeah, that was a great gig. I loved that. It was wonderful.

DF: I think that actually opened your tour last year.

BLADES: That's right. That opened the tour with us and Foreigner (and Journey). That was the beginning of the tour.

DF: My main gripe about that show was you didn't have more playing time.

BLADES: I know, I know. Well, hopefully when we come up and see you guys, coming up on this tour, we're gonna have more playing time.

DF: Yeah, I would imagine. Well, for starters tell me about your experience this week at the Republican National Convention, how did you enjoy that?

BLADES: Oh, yeah. Are you a Romney fan?

DF: Actually I am, yes.

Jack Blades performs "Back in the Game" at the GOP convention in Tampa, Fla.

 BLADES: Yeah, because he's from your neck of the woods. It was a wild experience. It's something I never, ever experienced. I mean all my life I've watched these things, I mean starting when I was about 9 years old in 1964 watching LBJ against, what was it, Goldwater or one of those kind of guys, watching on a black-and-white TV. And here I am, actually at a presidential convention, you know, and actually playing that ... it was bizarre. It was wonderful.

DF: Now Paul Ryan mentioned that his iPod playlist started with AC/DC and ended with Zeppelin, which I thought was cool, but I've got to think that had he wanted to touch down in the middle of the alphabet, you know he's got to have Night Ranger on there as well, doesn't he?

BLADES: I'm thinking that "D" is Damn Yankees and "N" is Night Ranger. I'm convinced of that. There's no question about that. (laughs) So, yeah, look, man, for me it was like an honor to play at this thing and I don't care what persuasion you are, whether you're a Republican or Democrat, you know what, man? We're all Americans, and that's the whole thing to be involved and sort of engaged in the political process is pretty cool. And what really got me is talking to a lot of the younger congressmen dudes that are like really trying to change things and everything. They're trying to shake up the old guard. You know, "Out with the old, in with the new" that's my theory.

DF: Well, I loved your performance of "Back in the Game," first, it's such a great song but second, I think it's got a message that really fits right now, but one interesting thing -- and you kind of touched on it just now -- is the divisiveness we've kind of seen the last several presidential cycles. But the other thing that's come up is the unapproved use of songs at campaign events to where several bands have come out and demanded that their songs not be used. Since you jumped into the political arena this week, I wondered what your thoughts were on that and also it does seem that most of the complaints come against the GOP, and that a lot of the artists allow their music to be played by the more liberal persuasion.

BLADES: Well, I think a lot of the guys feel real strongly about that sometimes. And you know what, a musician has every right to say, "I believe in this, I believe in that," cause it's the American way to say what you believe. That's what we're all about. You know, some guy writes a song and it's like, "Hey, this person is using my song and I don't agree with that" and stuff like that -- then hey, man, tell them, (but) don't pull the song. It seems like it's always shaded against the Republicans -- you know, I have a theory that it's just kind of one of those deals where they get the rotten end of the stick all the time. And I think it really pisses people off when there's actually Republicans that are looser, it like breaks up the stereotype of what people think Republicans can be. Like everybody's slagging on Clint Eastwood for getting up there and saying something. It's like, dude, I thought it was awesome. I thought it was loose. I thought it was totally awesome. The guy said what he wanted to say. And the guy would go somewhere and just when you think it was going off the deep end, he'd come back with a big zinger, man. It seems like in the conservative world, they're not allowed to sort of do that. I mean it would be OK if it was Harry Belafonte or something like that. But it's like, "You can't do that!" It's like, "You can't have rock 'n' roll, you can only have country music!" Stuff like that. Here's the deal, man, everybody at that place was trying to pin you down and everything like that. Man, I told them, "Look, dude, I'm a registered American, OK?" And what's with all the hating anyway? What's with all the haters? Who taught these people to hate so? Like, who taught them to hate? I mean, the beauty about us is like, I'll listen to your idea if you're on the other side of the persuasion, and I'll listen to that, and if it makes sense to me, I'm in. And that's kind of where I'm at. But it seems like you get shut down if you're on one side. The only way to be free in your ideas is if you're on the far other side. That doesn't get me, I just don't understand the hate. That's what I don't understand. Who taught these people to hate so? Enough of this. Enough of all this stuff. We're all Americans, man, let's just all pull together and do what's best for this country. Let's get those 23 million people that are out of work, let's get 'em working again, that's what I say. And all the other stuff? I think all that stuff is just stuff, and it's all just chatter. Let's get the folks working again, that's kind of my theory on the whole thing. And to tell you the truth, I don't care where the ideas come from, man. I don't care if it comes from Bill Clinton, I don't care if it comes from Obama, I don't care if it comes from Mitt Romney. Let's just get it done. You know, that's where I'm at. (laughs)

DF: Well, you're preaching to the choir ...

BLADES: Yeah, you know what I'm saying? I'm like, it doesn't matter to me, let's just get it done. Get 'er done. That's my take on the whole thing. And down there, I was seeing a lot of the craziness that goes on. You know, I think that these people have just trained everyone ... I just don't understand the hate, that's what gets me, man. It's not in my DNA. It's not in my makeup, spewing vitriol and just utter hatred. I saw it a little bit from people online when I did my song "Back in the Game." I'm like, "Really, people? Really?"

DF: I noticed that on Facebook, that you were asking, "What's with all the hate?"

BLADES: Yeah, I'm like, "Really, people? You try to shut me down?" Anybody that doesn't, if they didn't approve ... well, I didn't even say anything, I just went up there and played my song. (laughs) You know, I didn't spout some political ideology -- I just went up and played a tune. But ... "Really, people? Who taught you to hate?" It's sad, and you know what, that's going to stop because Americans inside are good people.

DF: Right. Well, they should take you out on the stump for the next couple months!

BLADES: Just what I need! (laughs)

DF: You didn't even need a teleprompter!

BLADES: (laughs) Let's get back to the music, man. Sorry we got off on a zag. Let's forget it all happened and get back to what's important. (laughs)

DF: Well, I was going to ask about "Back in the Game" again because that's such a great song and the video especially also, you know with the theme honoring the military and the troops, as the father of a daughter and son-in-law in the Marines, I really appreciate that ...

BLADES: Well you know what? That telegram that's in the video there is actually the telegram that my mother got informing her that her first husband was killed in the Battle of the Bulge, and I still have that, it's up on the wall in my studio. And those are his medals. The medals that are in the video are his medals ... and he's sort of a war hero, got that Silver Star and everything, and a Purple Heart. And so I honor the military for their steadfastness and their defense of our country. I felt like, OK, I've got a solo record, I can do what I want to do on this one, and so I made a mini-war movie, "Saving Private Blades." That's actually my son in the video that gets shot.

DF: Oh, is that Colin?

BLADES: Yeah, that's Colin, my youngest son, so there you go.

DF: Yeah, that was really cool. It kind of ties right into the local show that you will be doing here in Utah which is a benefit concert for Operation Rebound, which I'm not sure you're aware of this this far in advance, but it's a group that helps disabled solders stay active in athletic activities -- but that show is actually here in Utah on Sept. 11 ...

BLADES: I love it! Well, I've got to tell you, Night Ranger is honored to be playing this event, and we're honored to be with you guys, and we're honored to be there on the anniversary of September 11th, and believe me, we're going to be rocking in America with all you people out there, that's for sure.

DF: I know that you're an extremely busy guy with both Night Ranger and you having pretty new albums out, and I'd also be remiss if I didn't get an update from you on the next Shaw/Blades project before we're done here, but where do find the time to write so much? Is it just something that flows out of you all the time or do you really have to buckle down and make an effort? How does that work for you?

BLADES: You know, it's kind of something I've done all my adult life -- I think it's kind of in my DNA makeup at this stage of the game. There's just times of year where my brain just starts getting creative, you know what I mean? And the next thing you know, there's songs coming out. So Night Ranger has a live acoustic DVD coming out on Oct. 22, called "24 Strings and a Drummer," and it has a companion CD with it. So we have that release coming out. And Night Ranger is going to be on this weekend, too bad your thing's not going to be in the paper (yet), but this weekend on "The Bachelor Pad," I think it's coming out on the TV show on ABC on Labor Day. We're on the 3rd, on Monday night. And then two weeks later we're going to be on another show that's a very big show and I can't tell you about it, but it's going to be coming out in two weeks after that.

DF: So I'll have to figure out what that is, huh?

BLADES: Yeah, yeah on the premiere of that show. So there's a lot of stuff going on for Night Ranger. We keep going. And of course Shaw/Blades, Tommy and I are about three-quarters of the way through a new Shaw/Blades record, and we're excited about that. You know, it's just the way I am. I love to write, I love to create. You know, we (Night Ranger) had a new album out last year, "Somewhere in California." That's just who we are. We just keep doing it.

DF: Whenever I talk to Tommy (Shaw), I always try to get some of the new songs you've been considering working on -- how's that selection process going for you?

BLADES: It's going really good. We've got some surprises that will blow some people's minds.

DF: He told me about one song probably a year, year and a half ago, and I haven't said anything about it, but I noticed you mentioned it in a recent interview -- "Going to California"?

BLADES: Yeah, yeah, Tommy sings the hell out of that, man! That's a good story. You know what I mean? And we're doing "Tiny Dancer," too. We did a killer version of that.

Brad Gillis and Jack Blades perform in Wendover, Nev., in 2008. (Doug Fox)

DF: Yeah, I actually talked to you about that -- I last interviewed you four years ago, that's how long you've been working on this record, I probably don't have to tell you that!

BLADES: Isn't that funny, it just seems like it's been four days ago.

DF: I know, it just goes and goes ... but with yours and Tommy's mutual connection to the "Madman Across the Water" album, it just seemed natural that you had to do something off of there. I'm glad you did "Tiny Dancer."

BLADES: Of course.

DF: One of the magical things about Shaw/Blades is how your voices blend so perfectly, I've always wondered, how do you guys end up deciding who's going to sing what part?

BLADES: You know, it just happens. I've been fortunate with Kelly Keagy and me, and everything -- every band I've ever been in has had two vocalists, you know what I mean? And it just happens that way. Like with Night Ranger, it just happens like, "You sing this." "No, you sing this." It's like whoever's voice fits better. It was the same thing with Damn Yankees, with Tommy Shaw and me, and the same thing with us. You know, when he brings a song in or I bring a song in or something like that, it's like "Dude!" Like Tom, he'll kill this one and I'll kill that one. You know, our voices just fit certain things. We look at each other and encourage each other. "No, you do it." "No, you try it." "Dude, you've got it." It's like, "Oh, cool." And everybody, it's always that situation, with Kelly and I, it's just that situation where we go, "Yeah, you got it." It's pretty obvious what works for one person and what works for another one. I've been very fortunate, all my musical career there's been like two lead singers every time I'm in a band.

DF: Hey, since you have those two pretty new albums out, both your solo and the Night Ranger one, I wanted to get your thoughts on the current state of radio. I know a lot of bands from your era are in the same boat where radio stations still play all the old hits but when it comes to your new music, it seems almost impossible to get that on the radio, at least for very long. Have you had to temper your expectations or change your approach at all when it comes to your expected impact when you release new material?

BLADES: Yeah, you know what? We don't have any expectations when we release new material. The reason we keep creating is because we all have a theory, especially the boys in Night Ranger and myself. We have a theory that when you stop creating, that's when you start dying inside. So we're just going to keep writing songs and creating it, and fortunately we have a great record label in Frontiers Records that's totally behind us all the time and just encourages us. "Any new material? What have you got? Come on, let's do a new record. Let's do new material. Let's do this, let's do that!" And so we're so fortunate to have that partnership with them that they give us an outlet to keep creating because I think that's the key to anything -- I don't care if you're an artist, I don't care if you're a painter, I don't care if you're a writer of books. I don't care what you are. You know, when you stop creating, I think that's when you start sort of shriveling up and dying inside, so we're just going to keep coming up with stuff.

Night Ranger will release a new CD/DVD live acoustic package on Oct. 22.

 DF: I also wanted to ask you what you thought of the "Rock of Ages" movie because I remember you played one of the lead roles in the Vegas production of that one time, didn't you?

BLADES: Yeah, yeah, I played what Alec Baldwin played in the movie, Dennis the club owner, in the Vegas one of it back in 2006. I loved it, I thought it was really fun. I thought Tom Cruise did a really good job playing a rock star. You know, I thought it was really kind of cool. You know, I mean, it was fun. I loved the fact that the whole movie started off with the first song, bam -- "Sister Christian!" God love ya! It was supposed to have another one, "High Enough," 'cause "High Enough" is in the Broadway musical, but for some reason something happened and that didn't end up in the movie, which was unfortunate because I thought in that part of the movie it could have really used it.

DF: I was just wondering when we're going to finally see the Night Ranger, Styx, Ted Nugent tour?

BLADES: Yeah, I'm wondering that same thing, man, "When is that going to happen?" Night Ranger, Styx, Nugent, Damn Yankees, right? You'd get it all.

DF: And Shaw/Blades.

BLADES: Yeah, and Shaw/Blades. Shaw/Blades can open it -- you know, we could do it all, bro! We could be like our own self-contained tour, wouldn't you love that?

DF: Yeah, that's the tour I've been waiting for, for five years or more.

BLADES: That would be awesome, man! That would be absolutely awesome!

DF: Yeah, because when it comes to my Jack Blades history of live performances, I have seen you in Night Ranger, Damn Yankees and even Rubicon, but the only thing I'm missing is Shaw/Blades, so I've got to get that crossed off my list.

BLADES: That is so much fun. Bro, it's so much fun. I mean we just, like, sit there bagging on each other and playing acoustic guitars and singing songs -- we have so much fun when we do it. Tommy is the greatest guy and such a dear, dear friend, too.

DF: That's excellent. Is there anything else you'd like to add that we haven't talked about?

BLADES: No. Night Ranger is pumped up, and like I said, we're extremely honored to be playing on September 11th and being with our friends in Utah. I mean, I love it. I absolutely love it. So please, spread the love and spread the word, and we're looking forward to seeing everybody there because I know that every time we come and play in Salt Lake and thereabouts, we have a good crowd and the crowd loves Night Ranger. And I want everybody to know that Night Ranger loves Salt Lake City, and that's the most important thing, man. Keep the love going.

DF: Thanks so much for your time.

BLADES: My pleasure and we'll see you, gosh, it's just like a few days, a couple weeks, right? (laughs)

DF: Week and a half, something like that.

BLADES: There you go. OK, bro.

DF: All right, take care.

Tommy Shaw interview: Part II (Styx, Yes announce summer tour)

Styx guitarist Tommy Shaw in concert at USANA Amphitheater in 2007. (Photo by Doug Fox)

Styx announced its U.S. summer tour plans this morning, releasing dates for a 22-city co-headlining tour with Yes. The one-month jaunt, dubbed the "Progressive U.S. Tour," will kick off July 4 and conclude Aug. 3.

While Styx's tour with Yes will not have a Salt Lake City date, local fans of the band can look forward to a co-headline outdoor date with another well-known band in the fall.

When I interviewed Styx guitarist Tommy Shaw on March 12, we mainly discussed the impending release of his new solo bluegrass album, "The Great Divide." The album, incidentally, debuted at No. 2 on Billboard's Bluegrass Albums chart, coming in behind "Rare Bird Alert," by Steve Martin and the Steep Canyon Rangers.

The last portion of our interview, however, touched on Styx's tour with Yes, as well as other projects the band and Shaw have in the pipeline. Styx has probably been one of a handful of bands that have most taken advantage of the popular double- and triple-bill format — aggressively touring in packaged formats nearly every summer. Past Styx touring partners include REO Speedwagon, Def Leppard, Journey, Foreigner, Kansas, Boston and many others.

One touring package that is kind of the Holy Grail for Shaw fans would put Styx with Night Ranger and Ted Nugent. Once those lynchpins were in place, you could add on Damn Yankees (the 1990s supergroup that featured Shaw, Nugent and Jack Blades of Night Ranger) and also Shaw-Blades (the Tommy-Jack enterprise that has released two albums to date with a third in progress). What a night of music that would be — well, if you didn't have to sing and perform most of the night. As Shaw was quick to point out when I raised the possibility, such a nightly grind would certainly exact a physical toll. Still, for fans, it's a fun prospect to think about, even if it never materializes.

Also in the works, a DVD of last fall's "Grand Illusion/Pieces of Eight" theater tour and "Regeneration, Volume 2," a CD which features eight re-recorded songs from the Styx and Damn Yankees catalog. The CD, which will be available at tour stops this summer, includes new versions of "Renegade," "Blue Collar Man," "Too Much Time on my Hands," "Queen of Spades," "Snowblind," "Miss America" and Damn Yankees tunes "Coming of Age" and "High Enough."

Here's the concluding portion of my interview with Shaw:

DOUG FOX: I would probably be remiss if I didn’t ask you about Styx’s summer tour plans ... and I know the Yes thing is not announced yet, but in this part of the interview I’m hoping to get a few more updates and then when things become available kind of plug them in.

TOMMY SHAW: Well, we’ve been saying that we should do this for years, and it never would come through — I don’t know if schedules just wouldn’t allow or you couldn’t get everybody on board to do it. I don’t know your experience with Yes, but I just remember getting that first Yes album and putting that on and hearing that music and thinking, “Where did this come from? This is, like, music from another planet ... it’s better than anything I’ve ever heard.” It’s taken rock music to a level that I didn’t even know is possible. And Styx was influenced by Yes. If you listen to songs like “You Need Love,” you can tell they were listening to Yes. So we’re very excited about going on tour with them. 

DF: Is there a third band, too?


SHAW: There’s probably going to be an acoustic act or just someone to play, you know, to get people in the building. It’s a great opportunity for, like, an acoustic guy to come in and warm everybody up and introduce themselves.

DF: So will that mean that each of the bands, you and Yes, obviously, would get maybe a little extra time on stage as opposed to the triple bills?

SHAW: That’s exactly the plan. That’s exactly what the intent is.

DF: Can you just comment generally about co-headlining tours and how popular they’ve become in the last, what’s it been, seven or eight years?

SHAW: Yeah, we would join forces with people, and as fan bases get older, you know, some people, their life just dictates that you’re not going to as many shows as possible. It gives people a reason to go, “Wait a minute, these are two of my favorite bands, I’ve got to go see this.” And you wind up playing to their fans, and hopefully they become your fans and vice versa. It’s a great way to keep constantly infusing the genre with new fans. It’s a great idea because it’s working. We’re constantly looking out there, and I’ll say, “How many people are seeing Styx for the first time?” Routinely, it will be 20 to 50 percent of the people are first-time concert-goers to a Styx concert. That’s pretty amazing.

DF: And you’re playing with Journey and Foreigner in Europe.

SHAW: Yes.

DF: And you’ve been with both of those bands before ...

SHAW: Yes ... we all light a fire under each other, which is only that much better for the fans that are coming to see it.

DF: And I guess Night Ranger is playing with Journey and Foreigner during the summer in th U.S.

SHAW: I think that’s awesome.

DF: Now, I always thought ... and this is probably just my thought in looking at the tour schedules and what not, but Night Ranger has maybe never been involved, perhaps, with Styx as a full-time touring partner because it seems like they don’t do full tours very much but just kind of weekend dates and things like that.

SHAW: Right.

DF: Is this a change for them ...

Tommy Shaw stomping out "The Grand Illusion."

SHAW: Yeah, it’s a change. I’ve always encouraged Jack, you know, Night Ranger is such a great band, you really should do something like this. Not that I’m taking credit for it, but I’m just glad that he’s finally pursuing it like that, because they have the music, they have the hits, and they have a great band, and everybody’s still in great shape. When you go hear them, you’re singing along to every song — you’re getting your face ripped off by the guitar shredding. “Sister Christian” is in “Rock of Ages,” and it’s a pivotal song in that play. So I’m really happy to see them getting the recognition they deserve.

DF: You know, people think that Styx and Night Ranger would be the perfect touring couple.

SHAW: I don’t disagree. I’ve been saying that for years. Fortunately, they don’t listen to me because I don’t necessarily know what’s going to make up a successful tour. But I think eventually, I’m going to be proven right on that one.

DF: Because that’s the one a lot of fans are holding out for.

SHAW: For one thing, you know you’re going to get a third act out of it! (laughs)

DF: Exactly!

SHAW: Whether it’s on the bill or not.

DF: I think that’s why everybody wants it.

SHAW: Yeah, I would love to see that.

DF: Of course, I know the schedules lining up are probably the big thing that would prevent this, but people are also looking at the fourth and fifth act ... by inviting Ted [Nugent].

SHAW: They want me to die! (laughs) “Maybe he’ll keel over on stage and I want to be there!”

DF: They better get tickets for the first part of the tour!

SHAW: Oh crap! It’d be great for the first three days, and on the fourth one I’ll be on a gurney up there. (laughs) I like the concept of that, though.

DF: And then if you could just tell me what are the future plans for Shaw/Blades. I’m sure people would be interested in that.

SHAW: Well, there is a future, definitely. We just suddenly got sidetracked doing other wonderful things. But there is a record that was started already, that has some great songs on it, which I told you about. Once this [bluegrass project] has run its course for the time being, then that will be the next thing we jump on. We’ll finish that. We want to go play some shows, and offers are out there. So it’ll happen.

DF: And then the DVD of your theater tour [doing "The Grand Illusion" and "Pieces of Eight" albums in their entirety]?

SHAW: We’re in post-production with that right now.

DF: I know we’ve talked before, but you said the great thing about being where you guys are right now is there’s no set timetables or deadlines, things just kind of happen when you can do them.

SHAW: Yeah, there’s no rush to kind of put it out prematurely. So we can take our time and produce it the way we want it to be. We’re recording our old masters because the record company, there aren’t really any original people who were there during the days when we made those records — so whoever has the masters has not stepped forward. So we’re just redoing them. It’s actually better because it’s the guys who you’ve been coming to hear play it for the last generation are playing on it. So they sound very much like the original, except it’s like we put a bigger engine in it.

DF: So you really don’t know where any of these masters are?

SHAW: No.

DF: Wow.

SHAW: It’s pretty amazing isn’t it?

NOTE: If you missed the first part of the interview, you can find it HERE.

Tommy Shaw: Bridging 'The Great Divide'

Styx guitarist Tommy Shaw releases "The Great Divide" on Tuesday.

Tommy Shaw has spent most of his career cruising down the proverbial rock 'n' roll superhighway, foot heavy on the accelerator as he's helped steer the fortunes of successful mainstream bands such as Styx and Damn Yankees, not to mention other solo and side projects.

Now, he's signaling a significant musical detour.

"It's like I'm making a left-hand turn," the guitarist/vocalist said of his new solo bluegrass record, "but I'm putting on the signal about three blocks ahead."

For Shaw, recording "The Great Divide," which will officially be released on Tuesday, was not only a labor of love but a return to his roots and the music he listened to growing up in Montgomery, Ala. -- just 280 miles from Nashville. The record features several prominent bluegrass players, including the likes of Jerry Douglas, Stuart Duncan, Rob Ickes and Sam Bush, as well as some background vocal appearances by Alison Krauss and Dwight Yoakam.

Shaw was gracious enough to spend nearly an hour on the phone with me early Saturday morning for one of his first in-depth interviews on the bluegrass project. His enthusiasm for the release was obvious, even as he admitted that he didn't necessarily know how the record would ultimately be received -- whether in the bluegrass community or by Styx fans.

"Maybe I'm creating a side door -- at least with Styx fans and people who trust me, who've enjoyed my solo work through the years," Shaw mused."Maybe they trust me one more time to come in through this door and get a little taste of bluegrass."

If anybody can bridge "The Great Divide" between rock and bluegrass, perhaps it's Shaw.

And rest assured, Styx fans, we also discussed the band's summer tour plans, Styx projects currently in the pipeline, the status of the next Shaw/Blades project and a dream future co-headlining tour many fans -- and Shaw himself -- would like to see. All those things will be included in the second part of the interview, which will run in the days ahead. (The second part of the interview can now be read HERE.)

DOUG FOX: Well, first of all, let’s get the obvious question out of the way — what possesses a rock and roll guitar hero like yourself to venture into bluegrass?

TOMMY SHAW: Well, like any other major thing in your life, you often ease into it, to the point where you almost don’t realize that you started it. And this was one of those deals. Back in 2002, [my wife] Jeanne and I went to a Hank Williams tribute concert at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame in Cleveland. And I was asked to sing a couple of Hank songs, and Marty Stuart was there, and Billy Bob Thornton, who was friends with Marty, and they’d just done a record together, and Billy was hosting it, and Marty and his band were there. Billy’s using some of Marty’s guys ... so I just fit in with all of them. And so Brad [Davis] had played with Marty and was now playing with Billy, and so this led to us becoming friends with Billy, who lives in L.A. So we would go over to his house in the studio, working on a new album, and Brad had heard me sing some high part on one of Billy’s songs, and he said, ‘I need some high harmonies on this bluegrass project I’m working on, would you mind singing on it?’ So he gave me the file, I took it home and did it in my studio and gave it back to him. It was pretty straight-forward. You know, I knew what to do, I just followed him along, but it’s not the kind of thing that everybody can do. But he loved it, and he suggested we get together and try our hand at writing something. So the next time he was in town, because I think he was living in Nashville at the time, the next time he was in L.A., he came over and we wrote this song, “I’ll be Coming Home.” In fact, that vocal that’s on there is the vocal that’s on the writing demo. So, it just happened, I sat down and picked up the resonator guitar and played [hums guitar riff from the song]. It was one of those songs that kind of wrote itself. We just sort of sat there and out it came. And those are the best kind. I’m probably like a stuck record saying that, but, you know, I’ve been on a lot of albums and done a lot of records over the years -- not every song is like that, trust me. (laughs) And so when you get one like that, it, like, comes out fully formed, and so there’s not a lot of wondering, “Does this go with that? Does this flow?” Because it did, it just flowed. So we were off to kind of the start. We didn’t realize it, but we agreed, "Next time you’re around maybe we can write another one." And that wound up being about 10 months. Then he came back and we wrote “Afraid to Love.” We worked on that one a little bit, but we kept working on it cause we liked it, and it turned out really good. And then probably six months later he came back with [hums another guitar riff]. This is going to read funny with all the [humming]!. So he had the early makings of “Umpteen Miles,” and so he and I finished that one. And every time we would do one, we would record and mix a little writing demo, so we’d have something to listen to. So now we had three songs, and as far as I was concerned, three songs, you know, even when you have a whole album, a lot of times all you’ll send somebody is three songs so they can get a taste of it. So I figure we’ve got a story now, let’s play it for people. And that’s when it took seed, because we got so many good responses from people — all kind of the same like we’re getting now, you know, with me doing this, it’s like, “Huh?” And then people hear it, and they go, “Well, yeah, OK, I get it.” And so people were saying, “When are we going to hear more?” But it took probably another year and half, maybe longer, before Brad and I both had an opening in our schedule where we could actually pursue it. And that day came, and Brad just started coming, and that’s when we were really committed to it.

DF: And, so, how long ago was that?

SHAW: It was the end of 2009 ... the winter of 2009. Within a few weeks, I’d say the winter of 2009 we really started getting into it. He started coming, and we would write a song and do a demo. He would leave and come back the next week, 'cause he was having business with Coffee Fool company that makes the Styx coffee. That’s also how I wound up getting the Styx coffee was through Brad because he was working with Coffee Fool. So I would write stuff or get a little thing started, and he would come back and we’d finish it, or help me do the demo. Fairly quickly we wound up with about 15, 16 songs in various states of completion.

DF: As for the songwriting process itself, and you kind of touched on this with some of the songs, but were the differences in writing for this format simply subtle or were they more wholesale than what you would normally find writing rock songs?

SHAW: Subtle. That was the tricky part because I have a deep respect for the bluegrass community because it’s so ... when I first got my biggest taste of it, and I’d seen it for years as a little kid at bluegrass festivals out in the woods up north of from where I lived in Alabama. But I didn’t really get the full grasp of it until we saw Alison Krauss and Union Station in 1997 and heard these orchestra-level virtuosos just standing there, just quietly ripping the roof off the place. You know, I realized the depth of this music for it to affect people where they pursue it like that. So I wanted to be very cautious if I was going to do this, to not make the mistake a lot of people do, doing something that’s out of their realm. Like, when you’ve seen a lot of musicians probably go to Broadway, who were very successful, legendary songwriters and performers go to Broadway and they kind of take the attitude, “Well, I’m going to show you, this is how we’re going to do it downtown now.” And they come walking out of there with it kind of shoved, the little community there that goes, “No, this how you’re supposed to do it.” And I didn’t want to have that happen. I just wanted to be respectful. So we were very careful about, “Does this make sense? Would you do this on a bluegrass record?” And so one day I said, “Let’s just keep doing the next right thing and you can’t go wrong doing that, right?” So, that became what we said every day. At least once a day we’d go, “Just do the next right thing.” You hear that a few times and you realize, “Well, that should be a song.”

DF: So that’s where that song came from?

SHAW: Yeah. Then again I picked up the acoustic, and what I thought, this not only should be a song, this should be the lead song because I always envisioned, you know how you see some of the old bluegrass bands before they’d have electronic pickups on acoustic elements, they’d just have a few mikes around front and guys, when it came time to sing, they would all lean in and sing, and when it came time to play a solo, they’d kind of lean in and raise up their instrument and play it like that?

DF: Right.

SHAW: They would take turns playing solos. It’s kind of like an introduction to the band. Everybody takes a little four bars or something like that. And that’s how I wanted “The Next Right Thing” to be — the first song, “Here’s a little taste of what you’re going to hear the whole album.”

DF: I know you’ve mentioned before that you wanted to be very respectful to the genre and not be perceived as someone who’s achieved a certain level of notoriety in rock, or in another aspect of music, to where you would naturally think, like you said, “I’m just going to come in and do it my way and not their way.”

SHAW: Exactly. And I’m not naive enough to expect that they’re going to believe I’m a seasoned bluegrass artist, because I’m not. But this music does have a certain history in my life experience. It’s part of the texture of music that I heard growing up. This was as big a part of it as anything else. It was mixed with gospel, country and bluegrass, and even standards like Frank Sinatra, because we would listen on television to variety shows and that was all there on local AM radio. You would hear Roy Acuff and you’d hear Minnie Pearl on comedy shows. Then you’d hear Porter Wagoner, we always watched Porter Wagoner, and I liked Sammy Davis Jr. I loved the  gospel shows on Sunday morning. There was always a guy like Ralph Stanley and Bill Monroe with the high voices, and the same thing in the gospel community. I always loved that. So, this was nothing new to my ears and my musical tastes growing up. I was just new to writing and performing it. I just wanted to be like a respectful visitor coming in with my hat off and wiping my feet before I walk in the door.

DF: So, you’re telling me your musical career didn’t start with “Crystal Ball”?

SHAW: (laughs) Well, some might think it did — but there were some steps along the way getting to there.

DF: I know when you release a Styx album, you probably have a certain idea of what the reaction might be and how it will be received by your fan base. But I imagine that in this case, this is a totally different scenario ... what kind of expectations do you have for the album?

SHAW: Well, just because I had this reawakening, I don’t expect everybody to follow it. But I do have a feeling, just from my own experience over the last few years when I asked people what do they feel about bluegrass, almost every one of them said, “I love bluegrass.” People I would never in a million years expect it, because they’d say, “I have an uncle that played it all the time when I was little.” Everybody would have, kind of like me, a little story about bluegrass in their life story. So that’s one of the reasons why I think this could wind up being the first bluegrass album that a lot of people buy, just because they do like it, and they just haven’t gone out and bought any of it yet. Maybe I’m creating a side door — at least with Styx fans and people who trust me, who’ve enjoyed my solo work through the years. Maybe they trust me one more time to come in through this door and get a little taste of bluegrass. And so far, that’s what’s been happening.

DF: Well, I can attest to that. As you know, I have no background in bluegrass whatsoever ...

SHAW: Yeah.

DF: I’m a rock guy through and through. In fact, I think one of my friends said it best, when he said he tried to picture me listening to bluegrass. And he compared it to a vampire looking at the sun ...

SHAW: (laughs) That’s a great analogy.

DF: So, admittedly, I’ve had a lot of learning curve with this album, and I am finding the more I listen to it, the more I’m getting it. What would be your message to other rock fans like me, or Styx fans in general, who may be a little reticent to open their ears to something along these lines?

SHAW: Well, the songs are three minutes long, you know. You can try something for three minutes. You can hold your breath for three minutes if you really try. So this is a lot easier than that. (laughs) And the songs are enjoyable. They’re story songs. If for nothing else, to hear some of the best bluegrass musicians on the planet taking solos and playing some of the most beautiful, melodic things in the background on this record. It’s pretty stunning. And I can tell you that because of my respect for them.

DF: You just touched on it, but I think one of the things that really drew me in to these songs initially was the storytelling element — songs like “Sawmill,” “The Great Divide,” “Give ’Em Hell Harry” — is bluegrass as a genre more amenable to spinning tales like those or is it just kind of how things worked out here?

SHAW: Bluegrass, in the same way gospel is, you know, gospel there’s always a little more dramatic stories, almost a more narrow kind of a story. But at the same time, you can have these great tragedies going on -- you know, love and loss and death and pain, and then get to a chorus and have this happy, it’s-all-gonna-be-all-right chorus. Between the gospel, and the country and bluegrass music that I heard when I was a kid, there is that, there’s that uplifting thing. I remember when I was a little boy, my grandfather passed away, I was about ... 8 years old, and I’d never been to a funeral, never seen a person in a casket before, and there I was, and there’s my grandfather lying there in this box, and I was, like, “Why doesn’t he just get up and go home? Why doesn’t he wake up and go get out of here?” And it dawned on me what this whole thing was. And on the way home, this song came on called “I Remember You.” For the first time in my life, this music, it was like it was talking to me in this car. It was like, “This is exactly what I’m going through -- and this music, it’s like it knows how I’m feeling. And it’s just telling my experience through this pretty, this beautiful melody. And, you know, that’s always stuck with me. And there’s even a little yodel in that song, actually quite a bit of yodeling in that song. So that’s always stuck with me and to see how gospel singers do the same thing, these stories of death and pain, but there’s an uplifting chorus. I was drawn to that for writing these songs. And the song “Sawmill” is the best example of it because in the song, a guy gets, basically, sawn in two right in front of a child. But then there’s this happy chorus, “Have a drink of water ... ”

DF: Now that child in the song, that was your dad, right?

SHAW: Yeah. That was something that came to me because I was enjoying the idea of telling stories in this, and, like, “What stories do I remember?” That was one that always stood out with me. For one thing, the idea of a little kid ... it’s hard to imagine him and his father out there in the woods. And then these lumber camps, you know it's just sweaty, dirty, and it’s hard work all day. And then to have this happen right in front of you ...

 DF: It occurred to me this morning -- and, again, this may damage my rock street cred a bit -- but one of the first records I ever bought was Vicki Lawrence’s “The Night the Lights Went Out in Georgia.”

SHAW: Oh yeah.

DF: And I realize it was all because I was intrigued by the story in the song. Not necessarily the music itself, but the story it was telling, and how it kind of creates a whole place in your imagination.

SHAW: What was that song, (sings) “The night that Billie Joe McAllister jumped off the Tallahatchie Bridge”?

DF: Oh, yeah. Is the name of the song in that?

SHAW: Oh, you know it will come to me in a minute.

DF: It was in a movie, they made a movie out of that song.

SHAW: Yes, they did. And the girl had a name like Bobbie or something. We’ll figure it out in a second, even if we have to Google it. (laughs)

[EDITOR'S NOTE: We forgot to revisit it in this interview, but later figured out it was titled “Ode to Billie Joe,” released in 1967 by Bobbie Gentry. A movie of the same name was released in 1976.]

DF: Yeah, I had forgotten about that one, but the second you mentioned it, that song came right back to me. You know, in a small way, I think that’s why my initial favorite song on here is “Shadows in the Moonlight.” I kind of get the same kind of vibe from that song.

SHAW: It’s like a little movie, isn’t it?

DF: Uh-huh.

SHAW: But you want to know what happened! How did it end? (laughs)

DF: Yeah.

SHAW: It’s a cliffhanger.

DF: Yeah, in fact I’d been thinking, “I don’t think this question has ever been answered about what happened here. I’m going to have to go to the lyrics [when they’re printed] and see if I’m missing something.

SHAW: Yes. Not only does it have stories, it has a cliffhanger.

DF: Obviously that was intentional then?

SHAW: Yeah, we did like that. We thought about doing a last verse and we were like, “Nah, let’s don’t.” (laughs)

DF: How many different instruments did you personally play on this album?

SHAW: I played some acoustics, like an acoustic 12 string and a Dobro resonator guitar. Which I’ve been playing that chrome Dobro resonator guitar on records since I bought it years ago. Remember “I’ll Always Be With You,” the Shaw-Blades song?

DF: Oh yeah.

SHAW: It’s that same guitar. I played it on “I’ll Be Coming Home” and I played it on a solo, the first solo in “Shadows in the Moonlight” is that guitar. And I played Dobro on “Sawmill” and “Back in Your Kitchen.”

DF: Did you play any mandolin?

SHAW: I played a little bit of mandolin, but I left all the heavy lifting to the Nashville guys. I’m on it, but when it comes to a lot of those blistering solos, I went to the best guys I could find. I mean, I can play some solos, but I wanted it to be just shredding.

DF: Interesting. I was going to ask you about that next. You were able to lasso a bunch of co-contributors ... how did they all become involved and who are they?


SHAW: Well, they’re all friends of Brad Davis. They’re my buddies now, but Brad had worked with all of them before. And he’d worked in that studio. The ones that I kept hearing about were Chris Brown and Byron House — about what a killer rhythm section they were. Brad was always looking at them, kind of, as the core. Him and those two guys could really be the foundation of the sessions. Then the rest of it, we tailored that recording session around what dates were as many of those guys available, if possible.

DF: And I know Alison Krauss was also involved.

SHAW: Well, Alison, she sang on my solo album in 1998. She came and sang with me on “Half a Mind.” And we had met a year before in ’97, maybe I told you, when we went to see Union Station. My next-door neighbor is a casting agent, named Nancy Foy, and she was the one who turned me on to Alison Krauss and Union Station, their music. There was a rumor that Alison Krauss came to see Damn Yankees, and I just thought it was a bunch of bull because why is a bluegrass girl coming to see Damn Yankees? You know, a lot of times people say there’s somebody and you get there and it’s not. So, I didn’t believe it, but I guess she did come. My neighbor said, “Did you get the Alison Krauss record?” I said, “No.” She finally came over, put two of them in my hand and said, “Listen to these.” So I put them in the stereo and Jeanne and I listened, and it was like “Holy ... ! Wow!” And not long after that, Nancy said they’re coming to the Wilshire Theatre, and I said, “Let me talk to Charlie [Brusco], our manager, and see if we can get some good seats.” That’s what happened. So we went down there, and it was a very eclectic crowd, and, of course, an absolutely amazing show. And the band left the stage, hopefully returning for an encore, and a lot of times you make that decision, do you want to leave and try and beat traffic, and all of us said, “No, let’s stay. This is too good, we’ve got to stay.” So, Alison comes out and she says that, “I just wanted to let you know that one of my all-time favorite singers is in the house tonight” and it was a five-minute story about how “My brother and I used to listen to this music, and there was a health food store in Nashville, and these snobby people used to go in there and get their health food. And one day we went over there and we played one of his songs.” Well, I didn’t know who she was talking about until she said, “We pulled our car up in front of the store, put ‘Renegade’ on the radio, turned it up and then got out of the car — just to piss everybody off.” So she’s talking about me. I was just looking around thinking, “Who is it? Is it, like, Kris Kristofferson?” It could have been anybody like that. And that’s how she and I met. So we kind of go way back now, way back to ’97. And she and Jeanne are best friends, and that’s really kind of how it happened. Alison and Jeanne like hanging out so much, I was just lucky enough to be there when she came to see Jeanne, and she sang on my record. (laughs) What happened, she comes over and sings it, blah, blah, blah, then that’s done, then Jeanne and she are out in the lobby talking for the next two hours.

DF: Was there any hesitation to maybe ask her to be involved, even to the extent that she was, just based on her collaboration with Robert Plant [on 2007’s “Raising Sand”]?

SHAW: Well, yeah, exactly. I hate asking friends to do stuff. Especially on the heels of the Robert Plant record, I didn’t want people to think, now I’m just trying to ride on the coattails of that. And so, it eventually came up and she said, “Yeah, but we just won’t do a duet. I’ll just sing harmonies on there.” And I’m thinking, “Like no one’s going to notice Alison Krauss is on the record!” But she came in, and like I said, on one of the last days, she came in and within 45 minutes she had done these beautiful harmony parts. And then, there was another song Jeanne sent to her, “Afraid to Love,” and she said, “Sure.” Actually, Gary Burr had her come over to his house and she sang it over there. But it was very casual the way that all went down.

DF: I was actually going to mention this before because I remember you wrote briefly about it on one of your previous Comet.com articles, but it was about thinking about leaving early at a Fleetwood Mac concert ...

SHAW: Yes.

DF: Because I always make fun of people that leave early (laughs). Because they’re missing the best part of the show in many cases.

SHAW: Yeah. And I understand, you know, everybody’s got a story. Everybody’s not necessarily being rude, sometimes they’ve got babysitters and they’ve got whatever, but a lot of times you do miss something really good at the end because you save your good stuff to the end. There’s psychology [involved].

DF: You have a show coming up [on March 26] at the Grand Ole Opry ...

SHAW: Yes.

DF: Could you ever have imagined such a thing before?

SHAW: Not in a million years. No. I mean, no. Well, I couldn’t imagine a scenario that would put me there.

DF: So how thrilling is it to get that chance?

SHAW: It’s just ... kind of shock and excitement and disbelief and anticipation. It’s really kind of a bluegrass debut, other than the little thing that I did singing “Rank Stranger” at Station Inn. I haven’t played this in front of anybody except in the studio. So, yeah, I’m going to be boning up between now and then. It’s only playing two songs in two different shows.

DF: So two songs in each show?

SHAW: In each of the two shows that day.

DF: So, will it be four total or will you do the same two each time?

SHAW: [I’ll] probably pick the two songs and do those twice because it will be the house band doing it so they’ll have to learn the songs in the afternoon. They’ll probably just want to do the same two. It’s two different audiences. I thought it was funny, I don’t know if you saw that ad where it says my bluegrass debut on the Opry website, and at the bottom it says something like, “Also appearing that night, Carrie Underwood and Pam Tillis.” (laughs) You say, “What was that?” (laughs)

DF: That’s an eye-opener. Well, do you have any plans for any other promotional solo shows at all?

SHAW: You know what, we’re going to let this thing tell us what to do. We’re ready to do, again, the next right thing, because you don’t want to come this far and do a bunch of wrong things. It’s going to take a while for this really to get out there. This is not going to be a tsunami of a release, it’s going to be like a slow-rising river, hopefully. I want people to have a chance to listen to it and make up their minds, and then have there be a demand for me to go play. If that happens, then we know what we would do and know how we’d go about it, but we don’t just want to go out ... I think if we went out and put shows on sale, there’d be a lot of people, who’d come expecting me to do a solo show with an electric band, that would be confused and then I’d have this bluegrass band who didn’t sound like what they were expecting to hear, you understand? It could be a conundrum of a show, so I want there to be an expectation for it to be this music. So we’re just waiting to see if it continues along the path it’s on right now, which is nice, slow and steady and people get that kind of “Huh?” look on their face, and then they hear some of it, and it starts to grow on them, and then they want to hear another one. That’s one of the reasons we’ve rolled it out so slowly, you know, a little here, a little there, just ease people into it. It’s like I’m making a left-hand turn, but I’m putting on the signal about three blocks ahead ... so you don’t run and crash into the back of me when I just made that left-hand turn with no signal.

Related links:

Tommy Shaw is doing a daily song-by-song synopsis of "The Great Divide" on the Comet website. Check out his thoughts and listen to the songs here.

To read Tommy's blog post about possibly leaving early from a Fleetwood Mac concert, referenced in the interview, go here.

For the official "The Great Divide" website, go here.