Styx's Lawrence Gowan: Mystery Man in a ... 'Mystery Van'?

Lawrence Gowan performs during Styx's "The Grand Illusion/Pieces of Eight" tour. (Photo: Jason Powell

 (Editor's note: This interview was conducted on Sept. 16, 2011, and published after Styx's appearance at USANA Amphitheatre in West Valley City, Utah, on Sept. 23.)

If you’ve ever seen Styx keyboardist/vocalist Lawrence Gowan in concert, one thing should be readily apparent: Dude’s got a great sense of humor.

If it wasn’t immediately obvious from his early days in Styx – he replaced original frontman Dennis DeYoung in 1999 – when he would periodically roam the stage with a Polaroid camera taking instant photos of his bandmates performing and hand them out to the crowd as souvenirs, then it became more so over the years as he added further flamboyant stage antics and often hilarious pre-song banter to his onstage repertoire.

In several previous interviews, I’ve also never known him to be lacking for a witty quip to any question that deserved one. Which is why I knew I was on safe ground to try and have a little fun with him in our latest interview.

With that in mind, I reached out to two of his Styx bandmates in advance, guitarist/vocalist Tommy Shaw and drummer Todd Sucherman, searching for inside questions that might momentarily knock Gowan off his game. Both delivered excellent queries that yielded vastly different responses.

Shaw’s question, regarding a certain recent reoccurring antic that kept cracking the pair up on stage, provided the lead section of my concert advance story for the Daily Herald. (You can read that story HERE.) The question was posed in a way that Gowan did not recognize it as a red herring, but his answer touched on some of the behind-the-curtain-type things band members do on stage to keep things fun and entertaining for themselves.

The fact he didn’t recognize Shaw’s question as an inside parry allowed Sucherman’s suggestion to score a direct hit. Gowan’s immediate response to a reference of “Dr. Starlight” was to have none at all. The couple seconds of complete silence on the other end of the phone was priceless. And listening to him stammer his way through the next few sentences, while obviously trying to figure out how the information might have reached me, was a fun interviewing moment.

Gowan’s humor is also evident in the nightly lyric quiz he throws at the audience where he belts out a well-known line from a rock classic -- Led Zep’s “Black Dog,” Queen’s “Fat Bottomed Girls” and Pink Floyd’s “Another Brick in the Wall” are staples -- and exhorts the audience to sing out the ensuing words. With that in mind, I thought it would be fun to put him to the test on some lyrics of my choosing. He started strong out of the gate, but then stumbled down the stretch. Ironically, he failed to recognize the lyrics to an old-favorite Styx song – one in which he gets to strap on an electric guitar on the extremely rare occasions it makes its way into the setlist.

I had the chance to chat with Gowan after the band’s Salt Lake show and we shared some laughs over the inside questions and lyric quiz results. His great sense of humor makes him eminently teaseable – a rare quality indeed -- but he certainly gives as good as he gets.

Many bands of Styx’s era have made key personnel changes over the years, with varying degrees of success. It’s a tricky proposition whenever a major vocalist is involved – especially when deciding whether to pursue the best talent available or search solely for a sound-alike.

Styx – which also features guitarist/vocalist James “J.Y.” Young, bassist Ricky Phillips and part-time bassist Chuck Panozzo -- chose the former option with Gowan, a popular solo artist in Canada, and by so doing, scored a direct hit of its own. The strength of that decision has been validated on stages across the country over 100 nights a year since 1999.

Here’s hoping you enjoy my latest interview with the “Strange Animal.”

DOUG FOX: Well, you’ll be playing in Salt Lake a week from today [Sept. 23] with a group I’m not sure if you’re actually familiar with, it’s a band called REO Speedwagon ... ever heard of them?

LAWRENCE GOWAN: Ah, you know what, my knowledge of rock is deep enough that I have heard of REO Speedwagon.

DF: OK, I wasn’t sure if you’ve ever done any shows with them or anything.

GOWAN: Once or twice. As I recall, there might be about 11 million people who are familiar with one of their records (laughs). We’ve toured so much with those guys ... it’s funny, the kind of rapport we’ve built up with them over the initial years, particularly when we were out touring with other acts, is the kind of rapport we’ve built up now with Foreigner, with Boston and other bands who really have embraced the double-bill concept and know that people absolutely love it, and they can sense the kind of, what do you call it, the symbiotic thing that goes on between the bands, it actually enhances the night.

DF: Now every summer you guys are always part of a co-headlining package, like you’re just mentioning all these other bands that you’ve gone on tour with. As you are a part of those, No. 1, do you have the time, and secondly, do you take the time to go check out the other bands at all and see what they’re up to and what they’re doing?

GOWAN: Yes, we always do because we want to see what kind of state they’re in (laughs). Basically we like to know how the audiences are reacting to the other bands that are out there. We’re very much, we want to give people a great night’s entertainment of rock because it bodes well for us when we come back. So, for example, I would go out and watch Def Leppard, I’d be thoroughly entertained, and I loved watching their audience. I realized a lot of their audience, had never seen Styx before and were suddenly becoming Styx fans. So that’s one very good band and we got on tremendously well with those guys. So it was great for both bands. I remember Joe Elliott telling J.Y. that one of the first concerts he ever saw [was Styx] — I think it was in Newcastle, no that’s wrong, it was Sheffield, of course, that’s where they’re from — back in ’77 and how much he liked Styx. So I mean, that’s another great thing, it just kind of builds a great kind of comradery that ends up elevating that tour. I remember by the end of that tour everything was on full cylinders, to the point that at the end of the tour, I know that Joe was wearing a coat that J.Y. gave him, Sav [bassist Rick Savage] gave me his bass. I gave him the coat that I wore at the Super Bowl, he wore it onstage for the next couple of years. So, you know, it’s like that. I mean, I knew their show extremely well, in fact, I got to where I was, because I was playing guitar backstage so much, driving J.Y. and Tommy completely insane with my guitar affections. It’s funny because to learn some Def Leppard songs, Phil Collen would show me some licks before the show. So it’s fantastic to have the actual guy from the actual band who played the actual lick on the record show you how it’s played.

DF: That would be very unique.

GOWAN: So it’s things like that. And I guess, for me, I went out and watched Yes this summer, more than any other band we’ve ever been out with, because that takes me back to when I was 15 years old and just really completely immersed myself in progressive rock — and Yes was the band for me. And so to be on tour with those guys and to hear those songs every single night was a fantastic experience. It connected me with the 15-year-old who still very much, hopefully, is in every night on stage. So, anyway, that’s the connection.

DF: Well, you’re good because you just wiped out about five of my questions just by covering those bases ...

GOWAN: My answers, Doug, are so long-winded, you just go in there and pick something that sounds like an intelligible sentence and use it (laughs).

DF: One thing you mentioned just sparked another memory for me when you were talking about Def Leppard and them showing you the guitar licks and things like that, but back when you toured with Def Leppard and Foreigner, I actually had the opportunity to interview Tommy, Mick Jones and Vivian Campbell ...

GOWAN: Oh? All at the same time? Great!

DF: Not together, but all before that tour, in separate interviews.

GOWAN: OK, yeah.

DF: And so what I did was, I wanted to ask each of the guitarists if they could get up onstage with the two other bands, what song would they love to play, as a guitarist, of the other bands’ music. And both Tommy and Mick each had songs for the other groups, but when I got to Vivian — of course, Foreigner was one of his big bands growing up and he played with Lou Gramm in a side project [Shadow King], he said, “You know, I’m really not that familiar with Styx, and I couldn’t tell you what that song would be.” By the end of the tour, though, or even a few nights in, he probably would have realized he knew a lot more about you guys and figured out a song he’d like to do that on.

GOWAN: Absolutely. That’s quite likely.

DF: About REO specifically, what are some of the things that make it so the two bands have such an affinity for one another?

GOWAN: Well, it obviously pre-dates my time in Styx, really. Although I’m well into my 13th year with the band and this year is the year that they were touting the fact that this lineup has played more shows as Styx than any previous lineup, so that’s a big deal. But still, you’d have to put REO Speedwagon ... the Chicago, I guess you could call it rivalry I suppose, when REO and Styx were out at the same time. Probably, and I’m surmising a lot of this because I wasn’t there for it, but there was probably a bit of mutual respect mixed in with a bit of mutual rivalry, mixed in with trying to outdo the other band in some way, I suppose. I’m guessing that. Now, that takes a different form when you’ve been around and had a successful career for over a quarter of a century. That transforms into something else, but the pride thing still exists, definitely. Look at the fact that Tommy and Kevin [Cronin] wrote that song a couple of years ago.

DF: “Can’t Stop Rockin’.”

GOWAN: Yeah “Can’t Stop Rockin’.”

DF: There you go again, I was just going to ask you about that (laughs).

GOWAN: There’s all that connection between the two bands. Sorry, but what was the actual nature of your original question?

DF: Specific things that make your pairing with REO special, maybe the way the bands interact ...

GOWAN: Oh, they’re the only band that we’ve ever done the two-bands-onstage thing with. You know, people out on stage playing all at the same time.

DF: With Todd playing the fake guitar?

GOWAN: Right. Smashed after about three shows. That’s how much he loves The Who. Anyway, yeah, so there’s that, and they’re the only other band we’ve ever gone into the studio with. I mean there were 10 of us in the studio one day, 11 of us actually, Chuck was there, too. So, yeah, that’s the only other band that we’ve done that with, so we have a close affinity and whatever happens on the night we play Salt Lake City, who knows. We might take advantage of the fact that we’ll eat up every single minute that we can with playing as many, you know, Styx classics as possible, as they will do the same thing with their REO [hits]. You can never say for sure what’s going to happen.

DF: Do you know if there are any plans to play “Can’t Stop Rockin’ ” when you get together?

GOWAN: I do not know. It’s the kind of thing that I can never say for sure because I feel if I say, “Yeah it’s going to happen” like we’re planning on it, at the last minute it will be scrapped and you’ll be like, “What’s going on?” (laughs) Or vice versa.

DF: So there’s a possibility, but who knows?

GOWAN: Yeah, there’s always a possibility.

The members of Styx. (Photo: Ash Newell)

DF: Now with Styx, you guys play so many shows every year that I imagine things come very naturally on stage for you now. You’ve been playing together for so long and every element seems to fit together in its proper place. But are there things you still work on, just little things that you still critique or tweak in the never-ending effort to play a perfect show?

GOWAN: The funniest question, the most common question bands get asked, particularly bands playing a lot of material that’s 25 years old, is “Don’t you get tired of playing the same song?” Now that’s a question you get when a song is 2 or 3 years old, let alone 25 or more. It’s funny, the reason, at least for us, and I’m on stage with five other very like-minded people, every opportunity that you play a song in front of an audience is another chance to engage. It’s not the notes that you’re necessarily playing, it’s the fact that there’s an emotion that exists in that moment with that audience on that stage in that city and with those other musicians on stage. The opportunity is there to kind of lift that song higher than you have in the past in some way. And sometimes these can be extremely subtle ways that eventually amount to something really quite outstanding. It’s the tiny, little nuances that are within each song, between the notes, you know, in the breath in between lyric lines, the taking in of what the audience is kind of pushing back your way, that suddenly makes it take on a life of its own. And it’s not a tough thing, even though we might play “Foolin’ Yourself” a hundred times a year on a hundred stages. Each time there are things that you just ... first of all you can’t take your eye off the ball because the song changes gears so many times, and second of all, like lyrically and musically there’s a lift that happens if you’re ready for it every single night. And that’s the challenge for musicians, be ready for where the lifting, exhilarating moments are and try to make everything of them that you can. And that’s how you play it. Once again, I’ve drifted so far from the question I can’t imagine what it was.

DF: You’ve actually tapped into something that I think is the essence of what most people who go to concerts, at least I know it is for me, but we love going and thinking that the show that we’re seeing that night is somehow as special to the people who are playing it as it is to us being there, and it’s somehow different and unique in its own way.

GOWAN: And that’s a feeling that, luckily, I’m in a band of guys that are onstage where that same emotion is being sought out every single night. Yes, I do remember what you were asking, are there little things we tighten up here and there. It’s ongoing, never-ending ... it will never end — it can’t. And you know something? The moment it does that, you can hear it from the band immediately. It’s so crazy evident to an audience when a band is just simply hitting switches, you know what I mean, instead of engaging with the musical capacity of something. So, yeah, we continue to do that, and I can’t really foresee a time when we wouldn’t be doing that because this is the type of people we are and that’s what we bring to the stage.

DF: OK, for example, can you tell me about this inside thing that you and Tommy have had going on these last few shows where you keep cracking each other up?

GOWAN: Oh my ... we try to avoid the inside jokes on stage in some ways because the audience should be in on it to some degree. But because we spend so much time together, it’s almost impossible sometimes. So I happened to tell Tommy a couple weeks ago, I mean there’s always some little thing floating around that snowballs into an inside, inside, inside joke and try as we might to keep that off the stage, there are moments when it’s just invariably going to rear its head and it’s usually when we’re on the same mike, usually in “Miss America.” Usually not in “Lady” because that’s too early in the show usually for us to be playing any games with. But even in “Lady” we won’t make any eye contact because of the latest thing. And the latest thing, I can tell you was just this bizarre dream I had where Tommy came up to me before a show and described how he wanted me to play this particular song. It was in E flat. And he showed me, in the dream, showed me how my posture should be like for this part. Well, that just kind of stuck with me. And just before we walked onstage, I went, “You know what’s funny? I had this dream last night where you showed me this certain posture on this thing in E flat.” Well, he cracked up. Well, of course, oh no, that means the moment we come together onstage he’s going to definitely, there’s going to be a flicker of the eye that’s going to go, “Hey, remember that stupid dream?” By the time we get to Salt Lake City it will probably become something else, some other little thing. and, you know, it’s funny. These seem like the most insignificant and superfluous, and meaningless things and yet, they can be part of what’s really the glue, the joie de vivre that comes into the performance. So, hey, only a person like you I think would pick up on that. Some people that have seen the show a few hundred times would pick up on that sort of thing. Other people out there just go, “What a strange bunch of people!” (laughs)

DF: Well, we’ll have to keep an eye out for that next week.

GOWAN: You almost feel dumb revealing these things, but just think of it as an inside thing you could have with your family that only you understand. And it blurts out when you’re in the most public of places. “I hope that doesn’t happen on stage.” And we try to make a musical moment of it. That’s the difference.

Lawrence Gowan at USANA Amphitheatre on Sept. 23, 2011. (Photo: Doug Fox)

DF: Last summer we talked prior to the beginning of “The Grand Illusion/Pieces of Eight” tour and I know out here in the West we’re kind of feeling a bit neglected because we didn’t get to see any of that.

GOWAN: OK, right I know. J.Y. has said that. We have not done that show yet west of the Mississippi and it’s time we did.

DF: Yeah, I was just going to ask, I’ve heard some rumblings that maybe next year that might happen. I just wanted to check and see if there was anything new to report on that.

GOWAN: Well, we’re all really proud of that show and the DVD is coming out later on this year of us doing it in Memphis, and we almost didn’t want to burn ourselves out on it too quickly. We did 22 of them, and we actually reprised it a couple weeks ago in Atlantic City. But it’s a different type of staging, it’s a different type of screen content and everything. It’s a completely different mindset to do that show because, for example, “Come Sail Away” comes fourth in the night, you know what I mean? It’s the fourth song on that record. So it’s almost like we want to meter that out judiciously, you know what I mean? We definitely would like to play it all and completely on the western side of America, but more likely it could be next year. It could very well be next year because we’ll be promoting that DVD. I hope it is. It’s yet another piece of the tapestry that makes up this band and hopefully we will do it at some point. We couldn’t do it on this one because this is a double bill.

DF: Are you still able to find time to work in a few of those songs into the setlist, though, that you hadn’t been playing regularly from those two albums?

GOWAN: It’s funny, Doug, after we did it in Atlantic City, even the next night, you’re like, “Oh, come on, we’ve got to play one or two of these.” I know we started doing “Pieces of Eight” and we did “Sing for the Day,” and so we went a little bit deeper in album tracks for the next good number of shows after that. It’s quite possible that may happen in Salt Lake City but I stay out of the setlist thing. I used to get completely involved, and it’s best if I just leave it to Tommy and J.Y. because they have the best sense of what we should be playing anyway.

DF: Well I have a setlist request for you where you need to interject yourself, but I’ll bring it up a little later.

GOWAN: OK. All right.

DF: But first, because we started to talk about some of the upcoming projects you guys have in the pipeline with the DVD you have coming out and the release of “Regeneration I and II” being released together, what I’m really wanting to know is when can we expect the completion of “Dr. Starlight”?

GOWAN: (Pause) Oh my ... ! That’s incredible that you would even bring that up. Oh my ...  (laughs)! Holy crap! Wow! Now where did you hear of that? How did you ... what do you know? I’ve got to find out your information here.

DF: I’ve got to come clean — I had an inside source tell me that’s what I should ask you.

GOWAN: It’s a fantastic source whoever it is. Is he a Deep Throat type of individual, I guess? In the Watergate sense not in the ...

DF: Yeah. He sits behind you every night.

GOWAN: (Pause, then laughter.) That would be him. It would be him. OK.

DF: Honestly, I don’t know anything about it except I tried to find out, and I found some old song from Rhinegold, was it?

GOWAN: Rhinegold, yeah. Rhinegold is the first opera in the ring cycle by Wagner, yes. A dreamy, classically based thing and, you know, I have all kinds of other little musical projects that pique my interest when I’m sitting in a hotel room somewhere and once I got out some of my oldest stuff that was never even recorded and the guy that sits behind me went, “Hey, what’s that?” So, you know, (laughing) there’s all kinds of little things like that. Actually the thing I’m most focused on right now is that next year, when I do my little solo run, because I’ve done that in the last year, I’ve done seven solo shows in Canada, you know, that’s where my records were sold, and a good number of Styx fans made the pilgrimage there, that’s what’s involved in that. And it’s a different type of show, it’s the entire career that I had prior to joining Styx. Last year I did the 25th anniversary of an album I had called “Strange Animal,” which was a No. 1 album in Canada and had three songs go to No. 1 and it was a triple platinum record, and so we did the 25th anniversary of that, played the entire album and people really responded well.

DF: Yeah, I read good things about that.

GOWAN: Yeah, good. So next year is the 25th of an album called “Great Dirty World,” but particularly there’s a song called “Moonlight Desires,” which is a No. 1 video and song in Canada. So I’m working on a conceptual thing that revolves around that. Because I was an ’80s video act, known as that very much in Canada, I kind of elevate that as much as possible too (laughs) in the live show. So that’s mainly what’s gotten my focus at this time. But, hey, listen. “Dr Starlight,” it still bugs me that it hasn’t been properly done, [so] who knows?

DF: Maybe it will show up in the middle of “Miss America” some night?

GOWAN: Fantastic question, though, I mean, that shocks the hell out of me that Doug Fox from Salt Lake City asks about that piece of music.

DF: Well, he did say you would be freaked out by that!

GOWAN: I am freaked out! Yeah.

DF: In the past when we’ve talked, and in other interviews I’ve seen, as far as your tenure in the band, you’ve enjoyed drawing on the David Lee Roth-Sammy Hagar comparison ...

GOWAN: I like that comparison, yeah ... (laughs) go ahead.

DF: I’m wondering now in light of the current lineup of Van Halen, does that alter your view on that comparison at all?

GOWAN: (Laughs) OK, so what’s the current ...

DF: Well, David Lee Roth is back ...

GOWAN: Back in the band. Does it alter it, no, it doesn’t alter it at all. Another good comparison would be (laughs) ... you know, there really are no comparisons. I mean, I try to draw these analogies so that, I think the most difficult thing for people to understand is why Styx didn’t go the way of other bands who had to get new members, because invariably if you’re around for a quarter of a century, you’re probably going to need a blood transfusion of some description at some point, and sometimes it’s more drastic than others. Styx chose not to go with somebody who sounds like any previous member of the band. It’s not that I’m avoiding saying Dennis’ name — he made a tremendous contribution to the band, but I just don’t sound like him and I don’t play like him, and to some people that’s part of why the band has continued on because it kind of acknowledges his contribution to the band and it also acknowledges John Panozzo’s and John Curulewiski’s contribution to the band and even Glen Burtnik’s with the fact that he was such a great stage presence with the group. So we are the culmination of everyone who has been in the band in the past, but we are different people now. I mean, Ricky plays Chuck Panozzo’s parts on stage, but he plays them like Ricky Phillips, invariably. I can only do my own interpretation of the songs, and really it comes down to whether the audiences are accepting of that or not. And, you know, I guess at this point, the majority of them have been very accepting of it, and they understand that that’s how a band often has to continue or they cease to exist.

DF: Right.

GOWAN: So that’s the situation here, and I love the fact that when I first joined the band, the first words out of Tommy’s mouth were, when we were about to sing together, it was, “Hey, don’t play a Styx song here, play that song ‘A Criminal Mind.’ ” And then at the end of it, he said, “We should make that a Styx song.” And we’ve done it on a couple of live things. We did it on that “CYO” thing, which I thought was a great thing. That, to me, was an indication that they understand that you really don’t replace anyone in a band. That doesn’t exist. And I think that’s part of why the public has a tough time with it sometimes, is when they see someone as a replacement, but it’s not that. The continuation of the band depended on them making a change. So it’s a change they made and that’s it. For Van Halen it’s a completely different situation as to what their politics were and the same thing with Genesis and the same thing with countless other bands that have had to deal with this. That’s where it stands.

DF: Well the whole Dennis DeYoung comparison, I’ve written it before and told a lot of people who’ve asked me, I love the main incarnation of Styx before, so there’s no slight at all, but to me, the band now is such a fantastic live band, and your contributions obviously are a big part of that ... to me you bring much more of a rock performer element to the live show.

GOWAN: And that’s part of the schism that took place. They really became of two different musical minds, and that’s understandable and there’s nothing wrong with that. And in order to address that you may have to go through some painful times — and they did. And they came to the conclusion that it was best to change the band.

DF: Right. And another thing I think that you really add is like an element of humor ...

GOWAN: Oh, OK. (laughs)

DF: So, to me, while there’s always going to be the inevitable comparisons, it’s obvious, like you just said, you never really set out to replace Dennis, but were more intent on just incorporating your own talents.

GOWAN: Yeah, exactly. I was far more interested, and every day I feel like I joined a great band. There is no replacing anyone in any band — really ever. It’s just the way it changes. I mean, did Ron Wood replace Brian Jones? No. Of course, it’s easier for the public to accept when someone has left the planet, I suppose. But really, when particular musical differences are really ingrained and become, to some members they become a real sticking point, a band has to make a change. And this band made a change. And it’s so long ago now, it’s hard for me to even ... there’s so many old pictures of us now, you know? So it really feels like ... and the other thing is Dennis is out there playing, and there’s absolutely nothing wrong with liking both. I love it when people say, “I saw the band in the past and I loved it then, [and] I love it now.” And there are more Styx fans.

DF: Now when I mentioned sense of humor, there are little things that are noticeable, but one of them that I really like is the lyrical song quiz that you give the audience before launching into a certain seafaring number ...

GOWAN: Yeah.

DF: So I was wondering if I could turn the tables on you a bit and give you a quick test of lyrics?

GOWAN: Shoot!

DF: I’m afraid these will be too easy. “She’s got electric boots ... ”

GOWAN: “A mohair suit.”

DF: Yes.

GOWAN: “I read it in a magazine.”

DF: OK (laughs). “What’s a poor boy to do ... ”

GOWAN: Oh, that’s ... uh ...

DF: I’m going north of the border. I’m going to Canada.

GOWAN: Oh, OK. I know the line so well, but I can’t get it. You’ve got to sing it.

DF: (Semi-sings) “What’s a poor boy to do ... when he’s falling in love with you.” Does that sound familiar?

GOWAN: Yeah it does. Who is that by?

DF: That’s Loverboy, “Take Me to the Top.”

GOWAN: (Laughs) I’m sorry! I lose, I failed on the second question.

DF: OK ... “Jumped into a taxi, bent the boot, hit the back.”

GOWAN: Nope, I don’t know that.

DF: That’s Peter Frampton, “Do You Feel Like We Do.”

GOWAN: OK.

DF: “I’m your mystery man in a ... ”

GOWAN: Mystery van? (laughs)

DF: “I’m your mystery man in a gold Lincoln ... ”

GOWAN: No.

DF: “Midnight Ride?”

GOWAN: You got me. (Laughs, then suddenly realizes it's a Styx song.) Oh, it’s J.Y.’s! Oh, I love doing that one. I love playing “Midnight Ride,” that’s actually funny [to not recognize it].

DF: That’s the one last question I had for you, that I mentioned earlier that I wanted to talk about a setlist thing?

GOWAN: Yeah.

DF: For more than 10 years, it’s been my personal mission to see the full “Midnight Ride” in concert again. And I mention it to J.Y. every time I see him, and he always smiles and laughs. But then I thought, “Why not go to the guy who actually gets to play guitar on that song, he probably has a lot of fun.”

GOWAN: I love ... when I see “Midnight Ride” ... you know, we haven’t done it in a couple years, but when I used to see it right in the setlist I was elated because I took it as a tremendous vote of approval that my guitar playing was good enough to hack through those few chords behind, of course, Tommy and J.Y. And I loved playing that on stage, just loved it, you know, for that reason alone, plus I love the way J.Y. sings that. Actually, the J.Y. song I hope we do, and I love and I wish we’d do more of, is from “Pieces of Eight.” It’s “Great White Hope.”

DF: OK.

GOWAN: I absolutely love that song. I don’t get to play guitar on it, but that’s J.Y.’s personality, it’s so front and center and so strong. I see that as kind of where he was going when he was writing “Midnight Ride,” and worked his way up to that. But anyway, “Midnight Ride.”

DF: Tommy has said he loves playing it, Todd says he loves playing it, you love it ...

GOWAN: Yeah, everyone does.

DF: Does J.Y. not like playing it? I can’t figure it out (laughs).

GOWAN: I don’t know. One thing I know about Styx is you’ll never completely discern what J.Y. is thinking at any given time. And I learned that early on. Never kind of assume anything from the guy because he will surprise you every time. So he may suddenly go, “I want to do ‘Midnight Ride.’ And then on a night when four other guys are going, “Hey, let’s do ‘Midnight Ride,’ ” he’ll go, “I don’t want to do it.” So I have no idea. To try to unravel the mysteries of J.Y. ... well, if we ever do, it would probably be the end of the band.

DF: Well, you could just interject and say there’s been a request to see more of your guitar playing live!

GOWAN: That’s fine. Not a problem. I’ll say we’ve got to get “Midnight Ride” in there, definitely.

DF: I told him, “If I just get one more time, I could die a happy man (laughs).”

GOWAN: Exactly. Yeah, let’s do it!

'Coast to Coast' with the Scorpions

Backstage with Scorpions lead guitarist Matthias Jabs at USANA Amphitheatre.

 Rock musicians tend to do scores of interviews when they are out on the road promoting a new album and tour, so I never assume that they will specifically remember one they did with me.

That, however, was not the case at the Scorpions’ “Get Your Sting and Blackout” farewell tour at USANA Amphitheatre in West Valley City. The concert may have been the band’s last in Utah – but it provided a first for me.

It’s the only time I can remember being openly mocked eye to eye by a rock star for a question asked in an earlier interview.

I had a 20-minute phone conversation with lead guitarist Matthias Jabs nearly two weeks before we met up backstage prior to the Scorpions’ Aug. 16 Utah date. (You can read the full interview here.) At the end of our earlier chat, I asked Jabs this question: “Of all the interviews that you’ve done over the years and the thousands of questions that you’ve been asked, what’s the one question you wish you would’ve been asked -- but never have been?”

He laughed and said the answer to that question probably doesn’t exist, essentially responding that he’d been asked every imaginable query over the years, and was holding nothing back.

Fair enough.

Klaus Meine and Matthias Jabs in concert. (Doug Fox)

On the day of the show, I had the opportunity to meet up with Jabs several hours before he and his bandmates hit the stage with “Sting in the Tail.” We were only a few generalities into our conversation when I asked if there was a certain portion of the band’s live show that had become his favorite part of the night. With a complete deadpan delivery, and tilting his head as if giving the issue serious thought, he responded, “Wow, that is a question I’ve never been asked before.”

Admittedly, I was a little slow on the uptake. My first thought centered on the irony of him answering that to such an innocuous question considering what he’d answered in our original interview. I was still trying to wrap my head around his response when I noticed the slight smile on his face. That’s when I realized he was completely toying with me. I called him on it and we both had a good laugh over it.

I don’t know if Jabs simply remembered the earlier question because he’d never encountered a similar one – or maybe the band’s management had sent him the link to the full interview for him to review before our backstage meeting. Either way, I consider it an honor that it was memorable enough for him to take a good-natured run at me with it a couple weeks later. I mean, it could have been worse. (I’d hate to be remembered, for example, as the person who asked, “If you were a tree, what kind of tree would you be?” during a much-mocked Super Bowl Media Day session.)

One aspect of concerts that’s always intrigued me is how bands develop their setlists. Why, for example, do certain songs seem to stick in the setlist, while other clearly fantastic tunes get dropped after a year or two, never to return? Having seen 13 Scorpions concerts on 10 different tours dating back to 1982, I can tell you that they are always going to play the songs “Blackout” and “Bad Boys Running Wild.” Now, I love those two songs, but neither was what you would consider a hit single. On the flip side, great rocking tunes like “Can’t Live Without You,” “Can’t Get Enough,” “Arizona” and “Wild Child” have all but been banished from the band’s live show. How does that happen?

Rudolf Schenker in concert. (Doug Fox)

One of my all-time favorite songs, however, the melodic instrumental jam “Coast to Coast,” has remained a concert staple. Every new tour, I’m always fearful that this will be the time the Scorps finally drop the tune, off of 1979’s “Lovedrive” album. But it is always there, usually about five to six songs in, serving as a sort of transitory bridge between the first to second third of the show.

I mentioned this to Jabs, pointing out how grateful I was that “Coast to Coast” had managed to stick in the live show all these years.

“It’s like a drum solo,” Jabs said. “We have to play it.”

But not for the reason one might think.

Besides it being a fun song to play every night, Jabs said the main reason it remains is it gives vocalist Klaus Meine a nice break early in the set. The rigors of worldwide touring, sometimes with four to five shows a week, can take a toll on a lead singer, so the band always includes “Coast to Coast” early in the set and a drum solo late as a benefit to Meine.

Klaus Meine belts out a song. (Doug Fox)

We touched on several other topics during a 10-minute chat before Jabs was called away for a scheduled phone interview from South America – where the band will be touring throughout September, before heading back to Europe in October and November. I expressed surprise that the U.S. leg of the tour was over so quickly, but Jabs explained that the band will be returning at some point to the U.S. on this final tour because, “We haven’t played everywhere yet.”

The problem with this being a farewell tour, he said, is that everybody wants you to come right away, so the band is trying to touch all its bases globally before more in-depth return visits.

Three hours after our backstage meeting, the Scorpions launched into “Coast to Coast” on stage, with Jabs and fellow guitarist Rudolf Schenker cranking out the intoxicating rhythm and trading off lead solo breaks. The crowd was fully involved, and experiencing it live – not to mention rib-rattling loud from my vantage point a mere two rows and a photo pit removed from the front speakers -- brought a big smile to my face. At one point early in the song, Jabs meandered over right in front of our location and recognized me in the crowd. He broke out in a huge grin and spontaneously pointed right at me as if to ask, “Yo ... how do you like your ‘Coast to Coast’ now?’ ”

Well done, apparently.

On top of that, I figure Matthias and I are now even – because that’s a question I’ve never been asked before.

Note: For the full concert review of the Scorpions show at USANA Amphitheatre, click here. To see video from the show, click on the following songs: "Loving You Sunday Morning," "Raised on Rock," "Blackout" and "Big City Nights."

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Matthias Jabs: Sultan of the Scorpions' Six-String Sting

Date of interview: Aug. 3, 2010

 Matthias Jabs on the "Eye II Eye" tour. (Doug Fox)

Guitar solos are like fingerprints. Every guitarist has some, but they are highly individualized, and mostly unique to each musician’s background and style.

Guitar heroes are all immediately recognized by their signature solos – Jimmy Page in “Stairway to Heaven,” Eric Clapton in “Layla,” “Brian May in “We Will Rock You,” David Gilmour in “Comfortably Numb” and Eddie Van Halen in “Eruption.” Jimi Hendrix made his biggest statement by saluting the “Star-Spangled Banner” in feedback and distortion.

Which is why I was caught completely unaware in 1982 when I first laid ears on the guitar solo in “No One Like You.” I had no idea who this band or lead guitarist was – but what I did know was their record would be joining my collection at the first available opportunity.

That was my introduction to the Scorpions and Explorer-wielder extraordinaire Matthias Jabs.

From its opening salvo featuring a staccato burst of pinched harmonics to its ultimate explosion of melodic jam culminating in a gut-punching A-string slide, Jabs’s 34-second solo in “No One Like You” has no doubt made millions of females weak in the knees and forced as many guys into fits of air guitar fury during concerts around the world over the years.

Whether flashy (think “Rock You Like a Hurricane”) or understated (see “Your Last Song” on “Humanity: Hour 1”), Jabs’s solos not only fit the song, but they also lift it – and actually take you someplace.

In our interview, Jabs (calling from a concert stop in Las Vegas, Nev.) talks about the Scorpions’ farewell tour in support of “Sting in the Tail,” his use of the talkbox to enhance the atmosphere of certain songs, the melodic nature of his playing, why he doesn’t have many songwriting credits with the Scorpions and what happened with his iconic black-and-yellow-striped stage outfit from the mid-1980s.

However, since my indelible introduction to the Scorpions came with Jabs’s solo in “No One Like You” – that seemed like a good place to start our discussion.

Doug Fox: I’ve been a Scorpions fan for nearly 30 years and I can trace that back to one specific event -- the very first time I heard the guitar solo in “No One Like You.”

Matthias Jabs: Yeah?

DF: It’s one of the few guitar solos that I can remember exactly where I was when I first heard it. After hearing that, I said, “I’ve got to go out and get this album from a band I haven’t heard of before.” That was one of the band’s breakout hits in the U.S., but, to me, your solo really makes the song.

Jabs: Yeah, that’s nice to know. Actually, I heard, like, radio commercials for our shows that just had the intro, and not even vocals in there. So obviously, that’s already good enough to promote the show, or that song, or that album or whatever. So, that’s nice. Yeah, 30 years later, here we are.

DF: I was wondering if you could tell me about the creation of that solo – was it something you worked a lot on to get everything just how you wanted or was it more spontaneous and in the moment?

Jabs: No, it was like ... you know, in a good song, there’s more than one melody and usually the better the song, the easier it is to find the right additional melodies for it, and somehow that melody is well hidden in the chorus melody of the vocal, and I just developed it. But I worked out one. And when I had the main melody with all the phrasing, then I worked on the harmonies, too. But it was inspiring to begin with, you know, when I heard the song the first time. It had a working title back then, I think it was “Talk About You” or something, you know, before it was called “No One Like You,” and already, I said instantly, “Guys, I think we’ve got something here,” and when you have that feeling, then you put extra effort in to find the right components. And so with this one I knew it’s worth working out the guitar parts like they are today until they are really convincing.

DF: I’ve got to say that from the first note to that nasty slide you do at the end -- it’s, like, pure perfection.

Jabs: Can you play it?

DF: No, I play a little bit -- but I would like to.

Jabs: Yeah.

DF: Well, you have been in the United States for several weeks now, how are the fans reacting to this, your final tour?
                

Jabs: Excellent. I mean, we started out on the East Coast in the middle of June, and, traditionally, we were always stronger in the Southwest, where we are now, or all of the West Coast and, like, up to Chicago, but this time, with a fantastic reaction and lots and lots of people in New Jersey and Philadelphia and wherever, New York even. So it’s been like this on the whole tour now, great reactions from the fans, great shows and lots of people. So we are very happy with this, especially when we hear, “Oh, there’s a crisis and many bands have to cancel” or, “Shows are not doing so well.” But with us, I’m sure it helps when we say it’s the farewell tour. But we are getting people convinced to come out and see us one last time. It works well. It’s great fun, and we don’t think about, like, that it’s the last time every night. We just enjoy it so much that it seems like it’s normal [just] the beginning of a long tour, which is actually true. But the thought which we were afraid we would have every night, “Oh, bye-bye [said in melodramatic voice],” you know, that doesn’t really fly at the moment. It’s too much fun.

DF: I’ve got to say, as far as your manager [Peter Amend], you know, I’ve read how he brought up the idea to retire with this album and tour to you guys -- I’m not quite sure if I should love this guy or hate him!

Jabs: I was never sure about that either [laughs] -- even before he came up with the idea. I mean, it makes sense. There’s a certain logic to it as well. He argued, like, “OK, you have a strong album,” when he heard, you know, not the final mixes, but it came up when we played the music to him at the record company over in Europe, and everybody was so excited, “Oh, great new album!” And he came back a couple days later and [said] “The album is great. If you now go on the road ... ” and the previous tour took us like two and a half years around the world. He said, “This will be the same, two and a half, maybe three years, but if you call it the last tour and the last album, it will be exciting. It will be hard to top anyway in three, four years from now.” He said, “Do the math. You know, Klaus and Rudolf are already 62 years old, so by the time we are done with this whole tour, they’re like close to 65. Then you take a break, you start writing songs, you go back to the studio, the old routine. By the time it comes out, they’re 67 or something. And by the time that this tour would be over, they would be, like, close to 70.” And you wonder if it makes so much sense to sing ‘Bad Boys Running Wild’ when you are close to 70. I mean, at the moment, I must say nobody looks 62. And we are well fit and in great shape. Touring is like a workout program anyway, so we are getting more and more in good shape. So at the moment, everything is fine. And the idea was, OK, let’s leave a last impression to the fans that the Scorpions were already a great live band and we don’t want to limp around one day being close to 70 and create some kind of an embarrassment. Because sometimes some bands, I must say without mentioning any names, but some bands, they should have stopped some time ago. You know what I mean?

DF: Yes. Well, I’ve got to give your manager credit, because as you mentioned in talking about your shows in the U.S. so far, I think it has created a lot of momentum for you guys in being able to get a lot of people interested in seeing the band again.

Jabs: Yes.

DF: There are so many good songs on the new album -- which ones are you having the most fun playing live?

Jabs: We play, at the moment, three or four. You know, we change the setlist around a little bit once in a while to keep it interesting. But the four songs we play live are the title track, “Sting in the Tail,” that’s the opening song and always will be for this leg, and we also play “Raised on Rock,” the first single on the album, which goes down very well. And we play sometimes “The Good Die Young,” which is [Track] No. 4, and sometimes we don’t. And then, what has surprised me, the last song, “The Best is Yet to Come,” which I assume if we have, let’s say, 10,000 people in the audience that maybe -- it’s my guess, what do I know? -- but maybe 500 to a thousand have bought the new album at the most. The others could come from, like, “Yeah, I’ve been coming to the Scorpions since ... ” but everybody is singing it. So I’m thinking, and nobody plays it on the radio, but it’s amazing how everybody is singing that song, “The Best is Yet to Come.” You will see. So we play those four new tracks and they blend in very well with, like, anything from the ’80s or ’90s, so that’s all very good.

DF: Now, “Raised on Rock,” that you mentioned, has some great talkbox on it that really adds to the song. I’ve really liked your use of the talkbox over the years, you kind of sprinkle it on songs here and there, but never to the point where it feels overused or kind of becomes a gimmick. But I’m wondering, where did your love of the talkbox come from?

Jabs: I played if for the first time in late 1979 when we recorded “Animal Magnetism” for the song “The Zoo.” Because “The Zoo,” it talks about that creepy 42nd Street in New York, back then, now they’ve cleaned it up. We don’t even recognize it anymore because we looked for it when we were in New York just a couple weeks ago. And so, this song had, like, this creepy atmosphere, and to enhance this, to add something to it, because it was all the drug dealers, and all that, you know, sleazy, creepy feel in clubs and
whatever. “What can I do,” was the thought, “to enhance this musically?” And so the talkbox came to my mind. It was the first time I ever played it. And so I added just touches to it. Later on in the live version of “The Zoo,” like on “World Wide Live” or the way we still play it today, it’s an extended solo, but back then it was just there to enhance this atmosphere. And then, meanwhile, I used it in a couple songs, you know, not every album, if we played that would be like, “Ewwwwww,” But wherever it’s right, and on the new album we’ve found, like, for two songs it’s right -- “Raised on Rock” and “Slave Me,” there’s also talkbox in there -- and I just play in “Slave Me,” like the chorus riff with a talkbox as well. It adds a certain atmosphere, which I always like.

DF: That’s interesting to me that you had never played it before you played it on “The Zoo.” I assumed that you had probably had a lot of experience with it before then.

Jabs: You know, the thing with the talkbox is you cannot just set it up at home and play with it. It works in a way ... I have different ways of doing it today, but basically you need an amp and you need a speaker cabinet or the talkbox, which is something like a speaker. Therefore, you need to set it up, and it’s very loud. Even without amplification, the talkbox is so loud that, you know, if you don’t live on a ranch by yourself in the desert, the neighbors will come [complain]. It’s nothing to really rehearse at home.

DF: All right, interesting. Now, when you joined the Scorpions, of course, they were already a somewhat established band, but to me, what you really brought was great melodicism as a lead guitarist. No matter how hard rocking the rhythm of a song may be, whether it’s like “Rock You Like a Hurricane” or “Dynamite” your lead playing is so melodic that it totally ties everything together and makes it really accessible. It’s no coincidence that the band’s biggest hits started after the time you joined. Where does the melodic nature of your playing come from?

Jabs: I had it already, like, in the local bands I played before the Scorpions. There’s even one recording on a 45 vinyl and what you hear is a melodic in harmony-played guitar melody. You know, I brought this style to the Scorpions, I had it already before. Wherever it comes from, I don’t know. It’s what I like. And as I mentioned before with “No One Like You,” for me, guitar playing is, OK, it’s fun to be a bit flashy once in a while, but mainly, guitar playing to me is making music. And therefore, I play, like, what I feel is the best for the song. And even in a guitar solo, I think the song should continue, and not just, like, “Here’s a break.” And how radio treats guitar solos many times, “Here, just cut it out” because it’s some guitar player playing something. But if the song continues because of the guitar playing, then it’s even much better. And that’s how I treat it.

DF: Yes, it really comes across. I think it’s part of the band’s signature sound that way.

Jabs: Yeah, I mean, when I joined, I think for the first time the Scorpions felt like we were a unit, you know, a real band. And before, they made interesting music, but it was always two different styles within one band. Because of the previous guitar player, Uli [Jon Roth], who was so Hendrix-oriented that you could tell, “Here’s an Uli song, and there’s a Klaus and Rudolf song. So, you know, everybody admits that was a difficult time and it was two different styles at once, and as soon as I joined we sounded, yeah, like a unit.

DF: It’s interesting you mention the Klaus and Rudolf songs, because here’s something I’ve wondered over the years. Obviously, there’s no question that your playing has made the band more of a unit and has developed that sound, but I look over the writing credits in the Scorpions’ catalog, I don’t see very many from you, especially as many as somebody might expect for somebody who has such an impact ...

Jabs: You know, it is about how the band, or the other writers see it. Unfortunately, I must say, within Scorpions, it’s like all the stuff I add, for example, they consider as arrangements -- while in other bands, I know that the people go, “OK, whoever contributes something gets a share as a writer.” So, like, Van Halen used to do that in the beginning. It was always like four guys, always equal. Because all four do whatever they do. And when I joined, which is a long time ago, it was already established that whoever has the main, basic idea is the songwriter, and everything else is arrangement. So, there’s nothing you can do.

DF: So, you’re definitely writing a lot, it’s just not showing up that way.

Jabs: Absolutely.

DF: Another thing I thought you brought to the Scorpions was one of rock’s iconic stage outfits -- the one with the matching yellow-and black-striped pants and arm bands.

Jabs: Yeah.

DF: It’s too bad Stryper had to copy that.

Jabs: Exactly! I mean, as soon as I saw the Stryper album cover, everything striped in yellow and black, I took the stuff off and never used it again [laughs]. How original can a band be [laughs]?

DF: I was wondering, where did that outfit end up?

Jabs: Actually, that’s a good question. I think I donated it to some charity, which we did a lot in the ’80s, and I wasn’t really thinking about stuff, like, the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame in Cleveland, where they’re asking for it. I donated -- not donated, I loaned -- the guitar, my first Explorer, the one I played “No One Like You” and “Rock You Like a Hurricane” ...

DF: The Explorer 90?

Jabs: No, the one before, the first one, which I played “No One Like You,” for example, or “Rock You Like a Hurricane” or “Still Loving You,” all the early ’80s stuff -- that’s one in the original size. Ninety stands for 90 percent of the size, which I came up with later. But it’s at the moment in Cleveland and they want to display it, but they also wanted to have the black-and-yellow-striped pants, and I went, “OK, I’m not at home so I don’t know where to look for it at the moment because I’m on tour.” But I’m afraid I’ve given it away already.

DF: Can you imagine the reaction if you broke those out on a few dates of this last tour?

Jabs: I know! But, secretly, I wear black pants with tiny little yellow thingies here and there. It’s a hint, a micro-hint thought of it, but not in the same way.

DF: One of my favorite songs has always been “When the Smoke is Going Down” ...

Jabs: Yeah.

DF: It’s got such great imagery to it, what’s captured in the lyrics. I’m wondering, now that the smoke is kind of going down on the history of the band, does that song take on any added meaning for you guys?

Jabs: Um, no, not in that sense. We used to play it in recent years, on the last tour, for example, we used to play it as an additional song, like, after the last encore. We came out one more time, like the lyrics in the song describe, but with the audience still in there. It’s about, you know, everybody has left the place and then the vibe and everything is still in the building, but we played it as the very last song. And usually the towel wrapped around the neck, like, you know, if you come back from the dressing room -- and that went down very well. It’s a nice song to play live. Yeah, you wonder. We are not playing it at the moment, and I don’t know if the smoke is already coming down, it still feels like we are at the beginning of the last adventure, but I know exactly what you mean.

DF: So the smoke is floating around waiting ...

Jabs: Yes, it’s still floating [laughs].

DF: Hey, do you have any specific memories of concerts that you’ve had in Utah?

Jabs: Yeah, I mean, I remember, I guess, almost all of the shows we’ve played in Salt Lake City. We’ve been there quite a few times, though, over the years -- but I don’t think we have played that amphitheater [USANA Amphitheatre] where we play this time.

DF: You have not, that’s correct.

Jabs: Is it new?

DF: It’s new for ...

Jabs: For the Olympics maybe?

DF: No, it came after the Olympics.

Jabs: OK.

DF: I’m trying to remember ... the last time you came here was on the “Unbreakable” tour, and you played at the E Center, which was made for the Olympics.

Jabs: Yes, OK.

DF: And this was built after that time.

Jabs: OK, is it a nice one?

DF: Yeah, yeah.

Jabs: Good. Great.

DF: As guitar players, you and Rudolf have really carved out the sound the Scorpions are known for. How do your styles of playing differ and how do they complement each other?

Matthias Jabs and Rudolf Schenker "Face the Heat" in 1994. (Robb Hicken)
Below, Schenker on the "Unbreakable" tour in 2004. (Doug Fox)

Jabs: We really are different as guitar players, which makes it easier to work together, because it’s basically decided up front who plays what. That makes it easier. Rudolf likes playing the rhythms, even though I play the rhythms as well, I can tell you for the last two albums, I laid down all the rhythm guitars first. So everybody knows exactly how it goes, how the groove is meant to be and how, in case somebody, like a producer, wants to edit something, then he has, like, an editing reference. So, like I said, it’s for a few years that I’ve even put down the rhythms first, but then we work on the overall guitar arrangement and sometimes, it’s, like, if you, on the new album, for example, go to “Lorelei,” it’s one of those ballads, if you listen carefully, there’s like so many different guitars that blend into each other. I used, I think, at least eight different guitars, including the acoustics, so stuff like that, it takes a little bit of time to work it all out and make it sound nice. That’s not the typical song where you go, OK, like in the title song, I put down the rhythm and 10 minutes later, “OK, guys, this is how we do it.” You know, that’s an easy one to play. But, you know, some of the songs, they really need an arrangement, a guitar arrangement. But to your question, basically Rudolf doesn’t play lead at all, I would say, lately. And he played it in a few songs, usually the
ballads, never in fast songs, so that’s why it’s, like, decided. Over the many years we know who has his strengths where and for what type of song, so it makes it easy. Different than, I guess, if we have a band where both guitar players are, like, equal in what they do, then they have to probably find out, “OK, your idea is better than mine, that’s why you play this.” So we don’t have that that much.

DF: Of all the interviews that you’ve done over the years and the thousands of questions that you’ve been asked, what’s the one question you wish you would’ve been asked -- but never have been?

Jabs: Oh ... I don’t think that exists! [laughs] If so, I couldn’t think of any -- or I would have thought about it much earlier. I don’t think there is a question which hasn’t been asked. Maybe you’ve surprised me now! [laughs]

DF: Maybe this is it?

Jabs: Yes, this is probably it.

DF: There’s not something you’ve always wanted to talk about, but nobody’s asked you about it?

Jabs: No, I mean, I could just start talking about it -- if I really had the desire to talk about something.

To read my post-concert post, including details of a backstage meetup with Jabs, click here.

Read the story based on this interview.

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